Free for All: 12/12/12

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137 Responses to “Free for All: 12/12/12”

  1. Grandpa Dave Says:

    The last triplet date for 89 years.
    (I doubt that I’ll see it.)

  2. The mall shooting fell off the radar quickly. I don’t know if it’s because the gun jammed, which kept the number of fatalities down, or a conscious decision by the media to avoid exploitation and “stardom” for the shooter, but I think it’s a good thing. I still object to FNC sticking with O’Reilly’s moronic “War on Christmas” while CNN and MSNBC were live with the event, though.

  3. I think you need at last five or six deaths to make it a big cable news story. The only thing that made this story newsworthy for cable news was the location in a mall and the mask the guy wore. Sad but true.

  4. Also, the whole North Korea story broke open. Kudos to CNN for handling it live late into the evening. I was watching Ezra when they broke in with the news on North Korea. Oh, geez, that was painful to watch. Ezra knows how to get his geek on, but breaking news will never be part of his portfolio.

    CNN was still reporting on the shooting this morning. Soledad spoke with an employee who saw the shooter. Still one girl in serious condition but it sounds like she will survive.

  5. MSNBC covered it this morning, too. I didn’t mean to imply all coverage had stopped..just that it’s not getting wall-to-wall hysteria.

  6. Following up on the comment yesterday about Now on MSNBC using a new studio,
    Now is using the DC Studio.
    I agree it’s a better setup then in NYC where everyone is sitting at the desk.

  7. MJ had such a disrespectful interview this morning with MI’s Gov. Rick Snyder. Snickering, sighing, laughing while he spoke. It would have been nice if they had had at least ONE conservative on the panel to ask a question. I honestly don’t know why Repubs/conservatives appear on MSNBC.

  8. I think someone posted this last year, but I don’t care.

    photo/1

  9. You’ll want to click on the pic for a larger version. Would that that were always an option.

  10. Rick Snyder is a union-busting liar. He got the treatment he deserved.

  11. A question that is being missed in the Michigan Union incident,
    why were those union members and supporters not stopped by police when they started to take down the AFP tent?
    If there is any unedited footage of the event is anyone trying to stop them?

  12. In today’s edition of what FNC isn’t talking about:

    Sarah Palin Son Headed for Divorce Court

    http://www.tmz.com/2012/12/12/sarah-palins-son-track-divorce/

    Track married in 2011 and already getting a divorce? Gotta love those right wing Christian values.

    ImNotBlue – Was scanning over your recent post (yesterday) in another thread. I can respect your non Christmas-Jew status. Personally I think Jews or Christians that celebrate both are whack jobs You either believe in Jesus or you don’t.

    Well, with one exception — If a Christian and Jew marry and keep their respective faith and don’t want to seem odd to their children for celebrating without the other parent — it would be alright in my book. But, it seems to me Jews usually demand their partner convert.. Remember John King/Dana Bash? John gave up his faith and then got divorced. Wonder if he’s a Scientologist now? Maybe Greta can put in a good word for him with Tom Cruise.

  13. As for the tent, the incident started when members of AFP began throwing pennies at the demonstrators and yelling at them: “These are worth more than your jobs.” And Fox calls union members thugs. I think the Koch brothers can afford the cost of a new tent.

  14. Neil Cavuto was promoting an interview with Steven Crowder for his 8pm FBN show.
    They already covered this fight many times on FNC.
    FBN should cover actual business news and leave coverage of fights at a rally to their news channel.

  15. Some “TEA Party Patriots” group is running an ad right now saying that everyone should fight the tax increases on the wealthy because, in the words, Americans voted for the TEA Party.

  16. ^ It has the same voice-over as those Joe Arpaio ads. My guess is that there’s a fundraising pitch at the other end, and it does about as much as Mike Huckabee’s group.

  17. lonestar77 Says:

    There’s a link on drudge about Sheila Jackson Lee saying that “entitlements are earned”. Which got me thinking. The left loves to rename things to make them sound better. Illegals aren’t “illegal” anymore, they’re “undocumented”, etc. I’m surprised they haven’t come up with a new word to replace “entitlements”.

  18. Even Chris Matthews admits Crowder’s little stunt made unions look bad. If Fox News is going to continue to incite violence to establish a predetermined narrative, the left is going to have to wise up and stop responding.

  19. “It has the same voice-over as those Joe Arpaio ads. My guess is that there’s a fundraising pitch at the other end, and it does about as much as Mike Huckabee’s group.”

    It’s all a scam. I thought these SuperPAC ads would go away after the election, but the TEA Party groups are doubling down on them. They can’t even admit they lose. Yet fools keep giving these morons money — and somewhere, Karl Rove is getting very wealthy behind the scenes I’m sure.

  20. lonestar77 Says:

    Fox news is inciting violence? That’s failed kindergarten stupid.

  21. savefarris Says:

    Someone from FOX daring to cross the Michigan state line: encitement leading to violence.

    “Punch back twice as hard”, “Civil War”: tough (but fair!) political posturing

  22. “Even Chris Matthews admits Crowder’s little stunt made unions look bad.”

    The anti-union people barking are the same ones who say that racist TEA Party signs don’t represent the entire TEA Party or etc. If one idiot punching another idiot represents unions as a whole, then I don’t want to hear any more whining when the TEA Party people are labeled as racists.

  23. Crowder showed up with a camera looking for a fight, and judging from the video, got lucky with a crowd that was mostly peaceful. The first guy he confronted was a big as a house..would’ve crushed him like a bug. The one who ended up punching was pretty lame, and another very big union member pushed him back.

    Fox News is a political organization trying to create a story, and they put a young smartass comic in danger to do it.

  24. The double standard infuriates me. TEA Party “patriots” spit on congressmen, hold up racist signs, vandalize congressional offices, beat up opponents (there are DOZENS of videos of TEA Party violence) and their movement is praised, to this day. The videos of TEA Party violence being caught on tape are never shown. But every single left wing protest that turns violent ends up being front page news. Union employees are all labeled as “union thugs” and every young liberal in the country is labeled as a “lazy freeloader” and a “criminal” because of a few idiots at the Occupy protests.

    When a left-winger commits an act of violence, the entire Democratic Party is labeled and the media DEMANDS everyone denounce it. And we always do. But, when a TEA Party person commits an act of violence, they’re called out as an individual.

    You know, it’s just like these mass shootings and stuff, where white shooters are always labeled by the media as “clinically insane” and they always say that there’s something that must have triggered the gunman to act out. But when it’s a black person or a Muslim, it’s just another way the entire Muslim community or black community is labeled and stereotyped.

    You know what, I’m no longer going to condemn left wing violence when righties demand it just because I know what their shtick is. If you ask them to do the same, they’ll talk in a big circle.

    It just sucks because Crowder went there with the sole intent of starting a fight and, unfortunately, he got exactly what he went there for. It’s the same type of stuff Breitbart used to do. Ambush journalism. Eff ‘em. I don’t have any sympathy for Crowder because he got everything he wanted out of that.

  25. Andrew Breitbart was a jerk, but there was a dash of performance art to it. He was also a big guy who could take a punch. Little Stevie Crowder is way out of his league, and damn lucky that crowd was as calm as they were.

  26. It must be a living Hell to be a Democrat.

  27. -When a left-winger commits an act of violence, the entire Democratic Party is labeled and the media DEMANDS everyone denounce it. And we always do. But, when a TEA Party person commits an act of violence, they’re called out as an individual.-

    Andy, the opposite is also true. Who does “we” include? There are a lot of leftists who will not denounce such actions.

  28. Sharpton is completely destroying the “War on Christmas” crapoola.

  29. Allen West lost because the other guy cheated. Richard Mourdock lost because “liberal media bias”. This is the party of personal responsibility..

  30. ‘Conservative’ and ‘right-wing’ always seem to carry negative connotations among the apolitical. You don’t see that with ‘liberal’.

  31. Outsider — And righties are allowed to get away with it. If a leftist is attacked and the video is edited, righties are given a free pass by saying “the video’s edited”. Breitbart.com editing videos led to the demise of ACORN and caused a heavily respected woman to be fired from her job. And the only people who know all that are people who don’t get their news from FOX, CNN or ABC or the RW blogs.

    A left wing outlet edits a videotape and they’re crucified. Hell, the RWs are cheering on the Zimmerman lawsuit now. Meanwhile, the RWs still idolize Breitbart and James O’Keefe — who edited those videos in a way that the entire narrative was a lie.

  32. “Allen West lost because the other guy cheated. Richard Mourdock lost because “liberal media bias”. This is the party of personal responsibility..”

    They still think the majority of Americans agree with their fossilized way of thinking.

    “‘Conservative’ and ‘right-wing’ always seem to carry negative connotations among the apolitical. You don’t see that with ‘liberal’.”

    Are you kidding? “Liberal” carries the same definition as “socialist” and “communist” with the RW media.

  33. -“Liberal” carries the same definition as “socialist” and “communist” with the RW media.-
    Among the right-wing, which of course is expected but I was talking about those who don’t care much about politics, like the People Magazine crowd.

  34. lonestar77 Says:

    It’s fun watching Joe and andy lose their little minds. Seriously, what they’ve written is nothing short of crazy. Plus, there’s always Joe’s anger. Wait, you’re in a union, huh?

  35. Romney wins!!!!

    http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/article/2012/dec/12/lie-year-2012-Romney-Jeeps-China/

    “Apology tour”/”Apologizing for America” should’ve been the lie of the year IMO. If I had a dime for every time he spouted that BS, I’d be a 1%’er.

  36. “Among the right-wing, which of course is expected but I was talking about those who don’t care much about politics, like the People Magazine crowd.”

    People still read that crap? I thought TMZ replaced People long ago.

  37. “Liberal” is much more accepted in Canada. It’s a cuss word here, although that tide is finally starting to turn.

  38. The Zimmerman case is different because it was NBC not some blogger. NBC is supposed to be fair whereas a blogger who clearly has an agenda to push isn’t held to that standard.

  39. I’m angry? No, I’m a realist. FNC tried to start a riot for political gain, and the right is cool with it. That’s a problem.

  40. “The Zimmerman case is different because it was NBC not some blogger. NBC is supposed to be fair whereas a blogger who clearly has an agenda to push isn’t held to that standard.”

    Everyone should be held to that standard. A woman lost her job and has to live with being labeled as a “racist” for the rest of her life because of that crap.

  41. Maybe people should read People and watch TMZ. That crowd seems calmer than us.

  42. And FOX ran that edited video, knowingly and willfully, basically on loop. And then when they were called out, the RW media (Newsbusters, etc) went out of their way to defend FOX and Breitbart.

  43. A union thug beats up some guy and it’s Fox’s fault. There’s your “personal responsibility”.
    ————-
    [ponders silently] RT @trscoop: @noah_c_rothman how come Obama claiming Al Qaeda defeat didn’t get lie of the year?

  44. And nobody gives a crap about all the ACORN people who lost their jobs. Then again, half of the righties still think ACORN is around and that they stole the election for Obama.

    Those videos were a total fabrication — down to the part where James O’Keefe didn’t walk in dressed as a pimp asking for illegal advice. He was wearing a suit and tie and they called the police on him. But nobody seems to notice, nobody seems to care.

  45. “A union thug beats up some guy and it’s Fox’s fault. There’s your “personal responsibility”.”

    In my world, people who go out of their way to pick a fight tend to get one.

  46. It’s called “nonviolence”. People once managed to control themselves through a lot worse than Steven Crowder.

  47. “It’s called “nonviolence”. People once managed to control themselves through a lot worse than Steven Crowder.”

    Whatever. We don’t even have the full video of that “fight”.

  48. That “union thug” barely laid a hand on Crowder, and some much scarier dudes chose to stay calm. Yes, it’s FNC’s fault that the scuffle started, because they started it by having that little twerp infiltrate the protest to “ask questions”. It was designed to incite some already very upset people, and we’re all lucky it ended up as harmless as it was.

    If you ride up to a biker bar on a Honda, and start “asking questions” about why they ride those crappy Harleys, well…

  49. lonestar77 Says:

    Joe, Andy:
    PLease continue. It really is awesome. I just want to make sure I have it correct. FNC is involved in a conspiracy to make angry, unhinged, union thugs look like angry,unhinged,union thugs? And, it’s Crowder’s fault somebody punched him cuz he asked somebody a question? Annnnd, the media covered up for the violent tea party? Do I have it? That is a double shot of awesome with a lean forward chaser!

  50. “If you ride up to a biker bar on a Honda, and start “asking questions” about why they ride those crappy Harleys, well…”

    And to think the Republican Party is home to the deer hunting, NASCAR watching, moonshine drinking, good ole’ boys.

  51. savefarris Says:

    “Apology tour”/”Apologizing for America” should’ve been the lie of the year IMO.

    That’s where I thought they were going to. Of course, in a just world, “Raising taxes on the rich will solve the deficit/improve the economy/fix entitlements/heal the planet/get K-Stew & Twilight Boy back together” would have been the one and only nominee.

  52. To think the good ole’ boys don’t think we should do anything about bullying because it’s part of life and people need to learn to toughen up and they rail against political correctness and think this country is pussified, then they snivel and whine because a little punk got the punch in the face he earned.

  53. savefarris Says:

    Oh, and just so we’re clear: we’ve got a Senator in the shadow of the biggest media market in the country embroilled in not one but TWO sex scandals (one of which includes a bonus illegal immigrant angle) and the media’s response has been … “Who wants to talk about the fiscal cliff and how Republicans are all being unreasonable a**holes?”

    #whatliberalmedia

  54. Farris, let’s talk about Joe Scarborough’s dead intern.

  55. “That’s where I thought they were going to. Of course, in a just world, “Raising taxes on the rich will solve the deficit/improve the economy/fix entitlements/heal the planet/get K-Stew & Twilight Boy back together” would have been the one and only nominee.”

    Except someone would’ve actually had to say that. Democrats have called for revenues AND spending cuts.

  56. Did FNC send Crowder there or did he choose to go there? He’s only a contributor, that doesn’t mean he takes orders from them, does it?

  57. “we’ve got a Senator in the shadow of the biggest media market in the country embroilled in not one but TWO sex scandals”

    I care as much about these sex scandals as I do about Lindsey Lohan or whatever the f her name is.

  58. Steven Crowder got exactly what he wanted. He’ll dine out on that for years. He also made Unions look like a bunch of thugs, where some self-control might have prevented that. It’s like conservatives complaining about press bias. At some point you accept it, and try to avoid saying/doing something that feeds into it. Deal with it,

  59. “Did FNC send Crowder there or did he choose to go there? He’s only a contributor, that doesn’t mean he takes orders from them, does it?”

    Who cares? Bottom line is, he acted like a jerk. 12,500 people in an angry crowd and he goes out of his way to start a fight and got one.

  60. Really, Andy? Democrats are proposing another ‘stimulus’ package of some sort. Also, from what I’ve heard, it’s a cut in the rate of the growth of spending which is not the same as actual spending cuts.

  61. Andy, it does matter because it’s one thing for the commentators at FNC to exploit that situation and another for provoking it.

  62. “Andy, it does matter because it’s one thing for the commentators at FNC to exploit that situation and another for provoking it.”

    They did both.

  63. Oh gimme a break, LS. Whatever your opinion of unions is, those people on the ground have jobs under threat. Hard working people who’ve paid their dues – literally and figuratively – and have bills to pay based on an income and benefits that are suddenly under threat. Now throw in some overpaid TV kid with a pompadour and a leather jacket, shouting at people that they’re “takers”, or whatever the hell he was babbling about.

    There’s only one way to look at this: It was a setup. A dare. Complete bullsh!t designed to make union members angry, then freak out when it works. Roger Ailes is a GOP operative pig, and he’s bad for news media.

  64. Chris Tinglelegs is an idiot. He thinks if the guy who assaulted Crowder comes out, it means he’d be singled out and not all of labor?

    Does he really think FOX ‘News’ is gonna let that fly? HAH! The union employees at FOX will use this for YEARS to say that all union employees are thugs.

  65. lonestar77 Says:

    Roger Ailes made those union idiots act that way! Just like he did in Madison. And, when they beat up that black tea partier. Somehow, when union members gather, they get violent. Roger Ailes’ fault! Failed Kindergarten stupid, I tell ya.

  66. They planted Crowder to incite violence. Quit switching to other stories.

  67. lonestar77 Says:

    Roger Ailes shot JFK! And, he faked the moon landing, all by himself! But, really, he’s Elvis Presley.

  68. “Somehow, when union members gather, they get violent.”

    My point’s been made. Let’s ignore the violence at TEA Party rallies and say that all union members are violent thugs. #Stupidity

  69. “Fat Elvis”, for sure.

    What “violence” at Tea Party rallies? A little evidence might be nice, rather than repeating vague imaginings.

  70. “What “violence” at Tea Party rallies? A little evidence might be nice, rather than repeating vague imaginings.”

    http://www.lmgtfy.com/?q=violence+tea+party+rally

  71. I hope this 12/12/12 Concert runs all night. Epic.

  72. Got it. Assuming that those sources are accurate, what is your point? There was all sorts of coverage of Tea Party activities, and negative instances real and imagined. Your statement that Republicans aren’t questioned about these things is just stupid, and barely worth discussing, I haven’t seen a thing about Crowder or the Union riots on CNN today, so once again, you’re wrong. Maybe it isn’t a story worth covering, but you don’t get to spread tales of this alternate-universe where Democrats are constantly cajoled to criticize their violent loons, because it does not exist.

  73. “There was all sorts of coverage of Tea Party activities, and negative instances real and imagined.”

    If you were watching MSNBC. CNBC, FOX, ABC and CNN were basically proclaiming the TEA Party movement to be the second coming of the American Revolution. FOX made Sarah Palin out to be the female version of Jesus.

    “I haven’t seen a thing about Crowder or the Union riots on CNN today, so once again, you’re wrong.”

    CNN’s been covering , what’s it called? Oh yeah, news! Syria and North Korea — you know, real news.

  74. I don’t know what world you live in, but it’s name isn’t “Reality”. That’s why I rarely bother.

  75. Kanye West is going to perform at tonight’s Sandy benefit? I wonder what he’ll say. Will he criticize the poor response to Hurricane Sandy by saying “Barack Obama doesn’t care about white people”? Or will he proclaim that “Katrina was the greatest hurricane of all time”?

  76. C’mon Laura…… the TEA Party was INVENTED by the media. Rick Santelli anyone?

  77. I wonder where the protests were when Dubya slashed revenues, ordered two wars and an expensive medicare drug program and then bailed on the check? Didn’t see the “National Debt” clock running on FOX “News” then. Didn’t see the TEA Party protests then.

  78. “George Bush took the best economy in the world and wrecked it, but we don’t care about that. Obama hasn’t fixed it fast enough.” #teapartylogic

  79. I have no interest in the comparisons to other left- or right-wing rallies. My problem with this story is the “created news” aspect. FNC dropped a partisan shouter in the middle of a union protest in order to “prove” that they’re Bad People. By purposely antagonizing them. That’s a closed loop of news created by the news broadcaster. It’s dishonest. Send Bret Baier; have him ask real journalistic questions; then show him getting punched. If that doesn’t happen, ya got nothin’.

  80. The part that’s always missed is that these are union employees going out of their way to attack unions. Hannity and O’Reilly are hypocrites.

  81. I love how the clown prince of FNC Sean Hannity, who keeps referring to The President by insulting nicknames, makes it seem that only liberals and democrats say nasty things about republicans.
    Conservatives like Ted Nugent never said anything nasty about the President and Hillary Clinton.

    How many shows can Hannity do whining about the liberal media bias and liberals saying nasty things before the ratings go more and more to MSNBC and CNN.

  82. “I love how the clown prince of FNC Sean Hannity, who keeps referring to The President by insulting nicknames, makes it seem that only liberals and democrats say nasty things about republicans.”

    Ironic, isn’t it?

    “How many shows can Hannity do whining about the liberal media bias and liberals saying nasty things before the ratings go more and more to MSNBC and CNN.”

    Hannity’s a Honey Badger. He don’t give a crap.

  83. ^^^ those ratings are going to CNN? Well, that’s news. Next dumb stunt, CNN sends unsuspecting intern to rally to get punched.

  84. lonestar77 Says:

    Eh, no point. Andy may as well talk to himself. Definitely living in an alternate universe. absolutely nutso.

  85. “Eh, no point. Andy may as well talk to himself. Definitely living in an alternate universe. absolutely nutso.”

    Nope, I live here in Reality, where Obama was re-elected, climate change is real, evolution is real and man really did land on the moon.

  86. Remember when that moon denier said it to Buzz Aldrin? THAT was a punch!

  87. “Remember when that moon denier said it to Buzz Aldrin? THAT was a punch!”

    And I can’t blame him one bit.

  88. Crowder is a pugnacious child, and the only people who could possibly take him seriously are neatly contained in Sean’s audience. I’ll be surprised if it gets a moment’s coverage elsewhere. Shep didn’t even seem to bother with it that much.
    http://www.mediaite.com/tv/hannity-guest-confronts-steven-crowder-you-deserve-what-you-got/

  89. Steven Crowder is a Michigan native who’s been showing up in Lansing doing counter-demonstrations for years. He’s been punched by union thugs before and hasn’t ever made much of a stink about it. The fat bearded guy screaming profanity in the video with sunglasses on is a city councilman for a Detroit suburb.

    After Indiana became a right to work state and jobs started growing there, Gov. Snyder told local reporters that he decided against pushing for that in Michigan. During this past election cycle, however, the unions pushed hard for three separate ballot initiatives trying to get collective bargaining cemented into the state’s constitution. Working closely with the unions was a fourth ballot proposal aimed at preventing competition for the privately-owned Ambassador Bridge linking Michigan and Ontario. The political consultant for this effort was Dick Morris – when it comes to paying customers, he doesn’t seem to care whether the cause is a conservative or liberal one.

    Anyway, Michigan voters soundly defeated all of the union ballot proposals. With that issue already front & centre, the legislature decided it was politically smart to go for RTW.

  90. They mentioned tonight on LOD’s show that Joy Reid will be subbing for Alex Wagner tomorrow on NOW. I mentioned a few days ago that she might be in line for a show on MSNBC, at some future date, as I’ve been very impressed with her appearances on a number of shows on the network. It will be interesting to see how she makes out tomorrows sub-hosting gig. My prediction probably very well. We’ll see.

  91. Bill O’Reilly needs to stop talking down to his guest and not letting them speak like he did to Marjorie Clifton tonight.
    The “I’m a simple man.” line is getting told to.
    Simple and humble Mr. O’Reilly is not.

  92. I would love for that particular moment of violence to become a big story, but it won’t. Mainly because Sean wants it so much, and there seems to be a reverse-magnetism with such things. It wasn’t even mentioned on Special Report with Chris Wallace.

  93. Kanye West’s performance at 12.12.12 was the most awkward thing ever.

  94. “Crowder is a pugnacious child, and the only people who could possibly take him seriously are neatly contained in Sean’s audience. I’ll be surprised if it gets a moment’s coverage elsewhere. Shep didn’t even seem to bother with it that much.”

    Nobody’s watching cable news tonight. Why even bother?

  95. ^Man, Joe’s gonna hate that. It was great.

  96. ^ That’s some apologist bullsh!t right there. Dumbass showed up for a fight, and got one so weak it was almost embarrassing. The only sane coverage it got today was Matthews telling union protestors not to fall for such a blatant attempt at incitement. The rest was Hannity with his ridiculous sadface at those evildoers.

  97. “The only sane coverage it got today was Matthews telling union protestors not to fall for such a blatant attempt at incitement.”

    I agree. I hate that the one guy fell for it, especially since FOX got exactly the script they wanted. But I still want to see the unedited video. I mean, how many times have TEA Party people demanded to see unedited video over something that makes them look bad?

  98. On the one network that called out the TEA Party racism and violence.

  99. iON turned the concert off at 12:30am ET before it was over for a WWE show. Embarrassing.

  100. I’ve had it on AMC all night. I’ve never heard of the other networks airing it.

  101. ^ How many people did I have to explain the auto industry to after that damn Jeep crap started? The son of an auto executive blatantly lied that we were going to ship American jobs to China to build Jeeps. Pure fiction. Yet righty after righty on Twitter tried to edxplain to me how it was “technically true”. Because expanding production to China to serve the Chinese market IS EXACTLY THE SAME as closing plants here so we can make Jeeps there to sell here. Complete, unmitigated, horsecrap. Mitt Romney knew, and so did Fox News. But they backed him up on THE STRAIGHT NEWS SIDE.

    That vile campaign started with an ad showing Barack Obama repeating (and scoffing at) a John McCain line as if it was his own, and they defended it with some “good for the goose, good for the gander” gobbledygook. And ended it with “the Italians are moving Jeep production to China”. And I was excoriated for calling Mitt Romney a pathological liar. He was. And the conservative media backed him up. Yeah, time to “rethink”, fellas..

  102. You haven’t seen me angry you see my reaction to the CBS News report that Deepwater Horizon is leaking again.

  103. savefarris Says:

    Democrats have called for revenues AND spending cuts.

    Reducing the rate of growth by $100 billion in 2019 is not a spending cut and you know it. Democrats have called for $4 taxes now, $2 in increased stimulus now, and $1 in cuts a decade from now. “Balance” my a**.

    I wonder where the protests were when Dubya slashed revenues, ordered two wars and an expensive medicare drug program and then bailed on the check?

    A. Dubya didn’t slash revenues. They went from $3 trillion in 2000 to $3.8 trillion in 2008.

    B. Noone said anything about spending during the Bush years? Google says Not so fast, my friend!

    C. Bush’s deficits, as bad as they were, were still 4X smaller than Obama’s. Subsequently, you get 4X stronger the reaction.

    The son of an auto executive blatantly lied that we were going to ship American jobs to China to build Jeeps.

    Except … he didn’t say that. He said, and I quote from PolitiFact: Obama “sold Chrysler to Italians who are going to build Jeeps in China”.

    He’s certainly conflating the two when there’s no true connection. And he certainly IMPLIES jobs are leaving, but did he actually say it? Nope.

    Shady? No doubt.
    Deceiptful? Without question.
    Lie? Not by any reasonable definition of the word.

  104. You see, you start spouting numbers and I am gonna have to get involved. Bush DID NOT RAISE REVENUE with some magical tax rate reduction. Here are the facts:

    http://www.taxpolicycenter.org/taxfacts/displayafact.cfm?Docid=200

    Data compiled by the Office of Mgmt and Budget, ya know, the people who decide these things.

    Here’s another fact. Obama also has low revenue numbers. Why? BECAUSE HE HAS CUT TAXES!!!!! And we had the cataclysmic recession. Love how y’all act like that had nothing to do with our budget problems.

    Republicans fight taxes because they don’t want the government to have any more money. Fair argument. Sometimes you win with it, sometimes you don’t.

  105. You see, you start spouting numbers and I am gonna have to get involved. Bush did not raise revenue with some magical tax rate reduction. Here are the facts:

    http://www.taxpolicycenter.org/taxfacts/displayafact.cfm?Docid=200

    Here’s another fact. Obama also has low revenue numbers. Why? Because he has cut taxes. And we had the cataclysmic recession. Love how y’all act like that had nothing to do with our budget problems.

    Republicans fight taxes because they don’t want the government to have any more money. Fair argument. Sometimes you win with it, sometimes you don’t.

  106. And we had the cataclysmic recession. Love how y’all act like that had nothing to do with our budget problems.

    Works both ways. The “We went from Surpluses under Clinton to Deficits under Bush” argument ignores a little thing I like to call the Tech Bubble.

    Bush did not raise revenue with some magical tax rate reduction.

    2001: 2215.3
    2007: 2414.0

    In my math class, 2414 > 2215. Were you taught by those Michigan teachers?

  107. Joy Reid did an excellent job in her first appearance as host; subbing for Alex Wagner. No gaffes and she looked comfortable reading the prompter and leading the discussion. b not as smooth as Tamron Hall but already better than MH-P who becomes more shill every week.

    I think she gets a show of her own in the next year or so; perhaps replacing Thomas Roberts who seems to do way more segments about g*y issues than necessary. personally I’d like to see her on Morning Joe in Mika’s role; one where she might surprise a few people.

    On the MSNBC sub-host bench I’d place her below only Luke Russert and Ezra Klein.

  108. Was Bush not president in 2008?

    2008: 2288.1

    2215.3 to 2288.1 is hardly a jump in revenue, but if that is what you want to brag about, go ahead. Plus, you are ignoring what happened in between. Bush tax cuts severely depressed tax revenue for several years as he intended to do.

    And I’ve already spoke my peace about the tech bubble. If you wanna keep heading down this road, let me explain to you how Bush benefited from the housing bubble…

    BTW, I graduated magna cum laude with a BS in Mechanical Engineering, Minor in Economics and an MS in Mechanical Engineering. You can keep the math snark to yourself.

  109. fritz, I just love the idea of Joy Reid going toe-to-toe with Morning Joe. Somehow, I don’t think Joe will ever allow that.


  110. US to give Israel thousands of ‘bunker-buster’ bombs

    Pentagon asks Congress to increase military aid to Israel by $647M with aim of replenishing IDF munitions following recent Gaza campaign

    http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-4318508,00.html

    Must be nice to kick back and receive US taxpayer funded welfare. I don’t suppose any of the FNC patriots think $3,647,000,000 a year could be spent here at home, eh?

  111. savefarris Says:

    Was Bush not president in 2008?

    He was, but the downturn in revenues was due to the recession, so it’s irrelevant to our discussion … Unless you’re claiming that the tax cuts caused the recession, which is nonsense on stilts.

    If you wanna keep heading down this road, let me explain to you how Bush benefited from the housing bubble

    He certainly did. Still doesn’t change the fact that your accusation of Tea Party hypocrisy has been proven wrong 8 ways from Sunday. #thedanratherismsareflyingtoday

    $647 million?!? That’s almost … half of what Obama spent last year on himself. Please excuse me if I can’t muster up the outrage for less than 5 hours worth of deficit spending. It’s literally not worth the time to argue.

  112. Yeah, if I knocked the guy to the ground first, I wouldn’t press charges, either..

    http://tpmdc.talkingpointsmemo.com/2012/12/steven-crowder-no-charges.php

  113. Gretchen Carlson is subbing for Shep today.

  114. “Gretchen Carlson is subbing for Shep today.”

    That’s a good reason not to watch.

  115. She’s taken a bit of a tan.

  116. Do Americans even need a federal Department of Education? It seems kind of pointless if the states do most of the work. Billions could be saved.

  117. Americans are more charitable than Canadians according to a Canadian libertarian think-tank. Utah is the most generous out of the 64 jurisdictions studied, followed by Maryland and Connecticut. The first 38 places on the index are American.
    http://www.fraserinstitute.org/research-news/news/display.aspx?id=19079

  118. @ Caps

    What in the hell are you talking about, and what does it have to do with me?

  119. ^^ BS, Maryland and Connecticut are blue states. Democrats don’t give to charity, only Republicans do. Or so I’ve been told by numerous righties.

  120. Seven hours later, Susan Rice is still BREAKING NEWS on msnbc.

  121. Everything is breaking news. To most news channels, the Allies winning World War II is breaking news.

  122. @PoliticalLogic
    D.C.: More Legal Guns, Far Fewer Murders, Despite Post- Heller Fearmongering http://zite.to/VxXQCj

    One can only hope the same in Illinois.

  123. In my reality, the alerts all read “Broken News”.

    Speaking of reality telly, maybe Bravo will come out with a Real Housewives of Baghdad… or Sects In The City.

  124. I want to know if panini presses are used by people with wrinkly paninis.

  125. I’m surprised “wrinkly paninis” wadn’t moderated.

  126. No, but it can be rectified.

  127. When the babe from Daily Caller disses you, it’s time to take off the neck-brace and go home.
    http://www.buzzfeed.com/rosiegray/other-media-provocateurs-pan-steven-crowders-perf

  128. DC’s an unfair comparison to IL because, while guns were illegal in DC, they’re remarkably easy to get in Virginia. Does anyone remember the reports after the Blacksburg massacre showing how easy guns are to obtain in VA?

    Also, while guns may be legal in DC because of the SCOTUS ruling, their gun laws are extremely strict — to the point that it’s still basically impossible to obtain a firearm permit there.

  129. Ruh roh, Raggy.

    Via CBSNews.com: Panetta signs order to send Patriot missiles, 400 service personnel to Turkey

  130. @ ImNotBlue

    What in the hell are you talking about, and what does it have to do with me?

  131. I should really let this go, but…

    Yes, Bush was president in 2008.

    “He was, but the downturn in revenues was due to the recession, so it’s irrelevant to our discussion … Unless you’re claiming that the tax cuts caused the recession, which is nonsense on stilts.” — farris

    First, I have never and will never claim tax cuts caused the recession. Don’t put words in my mouth. Tax cuts are a form of stimulus – they don’t cause recessions, the cause deficit spending. Funny, you accuse me of saying something I didn’t say and then called it stupid.

    Second, in your original post with your made up numbers, YOU quoted revenue from 2008. But I guess that fictional data fit your narrative. You don’t want to include the 2008 real data because it DOESN’T fit your pretty little narrative. Personally, I’m glad you finally admit that business cycle has a tremendous impact on revenues – far more than small changes in marginal tax rates. Welcome to reality.

    “He certainly did. Still doesn’t change the fact that your accusation of Tea Party hypocrisy has been proven wrong 8 ways from Sunday. #thedanratherismsareflyingtoday” — savefarris

    I have no idea what you are talking about here since I never mentioned Tea Party, hypocrisy, or dan rather. I simply called out the myth that Bush Tax Cuts caused an increase in tax revenue.

  132. caps321 Says:
    December 14, 2012 at 5:08 am

    Please see:

    caps321 Says:
    December 12, 2012 at 1:03 pm

    And then explain what it has to do with me.

    Or, for a change… just go troll somewhere else. Yeah, that one sounds good too.

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